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	<title>Comments on: MBA: Congestion Pricing</title>
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	<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/</link>
	<description>Documenting Livable Streets Worldwide</description>
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		<title>By: Ines Alveano</title>
		<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/comment-page-1/#comment-265595</link>
		<dc:creator>Ines Alveano</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Mar 2013 17:52:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.streetfilms.org/?p=49591#comment-265595</guid>
		<description>People change opinion, even though they don&#039;t know why... Jonas Eliasson. TedX  http://www.ted.com/talks/jonas_eliasson_how_to_solve_traffic_jams.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>People change opinion, even though they don't know why... Jonas Eliasson. TedX  http://www.ted.com/talks/jonas_eliasson_how_to_solve_traffic_jams.html</p>
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		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/comment-page-1/#comment-261073</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Apr 2011 20:01:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.streetfilms.org/?p=49591#comment-261073</guid>
		<description>I support pricng precisely because I like cars and driving open roads; many people that vote against pricing don&#039;t understand it and/or pricing is proposed without a complementary and viable, i.e., high-capacity, reliable, and affordable alternative to driving.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I support pricng precisely because I like cars and driving open roads; many people that vote against pricing don't understand it and/or pricing is proposed without a complementary and viable, i.e., high-capacity, reliable, and affordable alternative to driving.</p>
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		<title>By: M1EK</title>
		<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/comment-page-1/#comment-257274</link>
		<dc:creator>M1EK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Mar 2011 18:27:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.streetfilms.org/?p=49591#comment-257274</guid>
		<description>v, it&#039;s still far easier to fund a rail line than it is to stop a business from relocating to a crappy suburban office park - again, outside NY and maybe SF (but even in SF they could and do decamp to places like San Jose).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>v, it's still far easier to fund a rail line than it is to stop a business from relocating to a crappy suburban office park - again, outside NY and maybe SF (but even in SF they could and do decamp to places like San Jose).</p>
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		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/comment-page-1/#comment-257067</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Mar 2011 17:05:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.streetfilms.org/?p=49591#comment-257067</guid>
		<description>The United Parcel Service President expressed support at a house committee hearing for pricing strategies in exchange for value - value being defined as improvement in flow of goods, and thereby more than offsetting reductions in operating costs.

The question is one of value. Value can&#039;t be captured if peak-period drivers are not provided with a high capacity, affordable, and reliable alternative to driving. Prcing and *real* transit has to be done at the same time.

Just sayin&#039;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The United Parcel Service President expressed support at a house committee hearing for pricing strategies in exchange for value - value being defined as improvement in flow of goods, and thereby more than offsetting reductions in operating costs.</p>
<p>The question is one of value. Value can't be captured if peak-period drivers are not provided with a high capacity, affordable, and reliable alternative to driving. Prcing and *real* transit has to be done at the same time.</p>
<p>Just sayin'</p>
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		<title>By: Knut Bøe</title>
		<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/comment-page-1/#comment-257028</link>
		<dc:creator>Knut Bøe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Mar 2011 12:27:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.streetfilms.org/?p=49591#comment-257028</guid>
		<description>Pricing is simple, it works, but it does not solve all the problems, and it favours welloff people who once again can pay their way through the system. No; the idea of the priority system of Trafficlogistics has to be developed, this is the way forward. Please see: http://trafikklogistikk.com  a folder explaining what TL is.
regards Knut</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pricing is simple, it works, but it does not solve all the problems, and it favours welloff people who once again can pay their way through the system. No; the idea of the priority system of Trafficlogistics has to be developed, this is the way forward. Please see: <a href="http://trafikklogistikk.com" rel="nofollow">http://trafikklogistikk.com</a>  a folder explaining what TL is.<br />
regards Knut</p>
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		<title>By: Rob Anderson</title>
		<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/comment-page-1/#comment-256934</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob Anderson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Mar 2011 01:19:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.streetfilms.org/?p=49591#comment-256934</guid>
		<description>A couple of years ago the SF Chamber of Commerce asked about congestion pricing in a poll, and 61% opposed the idea. I don&#039;t think the people of SF will ever allow City Hall to make them pay to drive downtown in their own city. Not going to happen. It&#039;s just a fantasy of the anti-car movement.
http://www.sfchamber.com/newspolicy/policy/special/sfcc_citybeat_poll09.pdf</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A couple of years ago the SF Chamber of Commerce asked about congestion pricing in a poll, and 61% opposed the idea. I don't think the people of SF will ever allow City Hall to make them pay to drive downtown in their own city. Not going to happen. It's just a fantasy of the anti-car movement.<br />
<a href="http://www.sfchamber.com/newspolicy/policy/special/sfcc_citybeat_poll09.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.sfchamber.com/newspolicy/policy/special/sfcc_citybeat_poll09.pdf</a></p>
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		<title>By: Suzanne</title>
		<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/comment-page-1/#comment-256858</link>
		<dc:creator>Suzanne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Mar 2011 18:38:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.streetfilms.org/?p=49591#comment-256858</guid>
		<description>What Rob said.

Also, it seems more like a matter of political will than anything else. There are plenty of options available in the toolbox - a *REAL* BRT (doesn&#039;t cost that much) and a viable, safe network of bike lanes (which costs even less) combined with an effective mass transit system that&#039;s NOT constantly being raided to plug in the holes in Albany&#039;s budget. The only thing holding us back seems to be nothing more than a small but wealthy, politically connected and unbelievably short-sighted minority.

There&#039;s absolutely no way adding lanes for cars is going to do anything other than encourage more traffic and congestion. I don&#039;t really know what the problem is in London (it certain works beautifully in Stockholm). That should be looked into, but I&#039;m sure the fact that there are fewer cars in the city &quot;centre&quot; is all to the good.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What Rob said.</p>
<p>Also, it seems more like a matter of political will than anything else. There are plenty of options available in the toolbox - a *REAL* BRT (doesn't cost that much) and a viable, safe network of bike lanes (which costs even less) combined with an effective mass transit system that's NOT constantly being raided to plug in the holes in Albany's budget. The only thing holding us back seems to be nothing more than a small but wealthy, politically connected and unbelievably short-sighted minority.</p>
<p>There's absolutely no way adding lanes for cars is going to do anything other than encourage more traffic and congestion. I don't really know what the problem is in London (it certain works beautifully in Stockholm). That should be looked into, but I'm sure the fact that there are fewer cars in the city "centre" is all to the good.</p>
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		<title>By: Clarence Eckerson, Jr.</title>
		<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/comment-page-1/#comment-256823</link>
		<dc:creator>Clarence Eckerson, Jr.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Mar 2011 15:05:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.streetfilms.org/?p=49591#comment-256823</guid>
		<description>Zach

We are making the full series available on DVD at the close of the series.  Many communities/advocacy groups are planning on purchasing a DVD and hosting a showing in their city by showing all of them, or many of the ones in the series.

You can pre-order the DVD above or wait until the final film comes out and come back for more details.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Zach</p>
<p>We are making the full series available on DVD at the close of the series.  Many communities/advocacy groups are planning on purchasing a DVD and hosting a showing in their city by showing all of them, or many of the ones in the series.</p>
<p>You can pre-order the DVD above or wait until the final film comes out and come back for more details.</p>
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		<title>By: v</title>
		<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/comment-page-1/#comment-256821</link>
		<dc:creator>v</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Mar 2011 14:46:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.streetfilms.org/?p=49591#comment-256821</guid>
		<description>M1EK - Though I am often inclined to go with carrots instead of sticks, I think that both are needed when it comes to getting dangerous/polluting vehicles out of city centers. Also, our current political environment isn&#039;t exactly making new rail lines easy to fund.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>M1EK - Though I am often inclined to go with carrots instead of sticks, I think that both are needed when it comes to getting dangerous/polluting vehicles out of city centers. Also, our current political environment isn't exactly making new rail lines easy to fund.</p>
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		<title>By: M1EK</title>
		<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/comment-page-1/#comment-256788</link>
		<dc:creator>M1EK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Mar 2011 12:30:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.streetfilms.org/?p=49591#comment-256788</guid>
		<description>There is one and only one metro area in the USA that could implement congestion pricing and see an improvement in conditions - that being New York City.

In any other metro, businesses would just decamp to suburban office parks at the first sign of their employees (more likely executives) getting upset at having to pay to drive.

This is not a viable tool in the toolbox here in the USA. Good rail lines (not streetcars running in shared traffic, but light rail in its own lane at a bare minimum) can incent people to leave their cars at home; focus on that. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is one and only one metro area in the USA that could implement congestion pricing and see an improvement in conditions - that being New York City.</p>
<p>In any other metro, businesses would just decamp to suburban office parks at the first sign of their employees (more likely executives) getting upset at having to pay to drive.</p>
<p>This is not a viable tool in the toolbox here in the USA. Good rail lines (not streetcars running in shared traffic, but light rail in its own lane at a bare minimum) can incent people to leave their cars at home; focus on that. </p>
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		<title>By: zach</title>
		<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/comment-page-1/#comment-256783</link>
		<dc:creator>zach</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Mar 2011 11:40:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.streetfilms.org/?p=49591#comment-256783</guid>
		<description>Awesome. Are these all going to be edited into some kind of movie?

Gridlock Sam brings it into the mainstream.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Awesome. Are these all going to be edited into some kind of movie?</p>
<p>Gridlock Sam brings it into the mainstream.</p>
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		<title>By: Clarence Eckerson, Jr.</title>
		<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/comment-page-1/#comment-256721</link>
		<dc:creator>Clarence Eckerson, Jr.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Mar 2011 03:04:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.streetfilms.org/?p=49591#comment-256721</guid>
		<description>D R Sanchez - there are equity concerns of course, but if the charges are indeed returned to the system for better mass transit, cleaner trains, more frequent service, then the lowest income folks will benefit most of all.

For example, in NYC we have seen a continued raiding for NYS mass transit funding - this keeps MTA fares going up, routes slashed, service continues to get nibbled away.  If we had a dedicated funding source there would be far better service.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>D R Sanchez - there are equity concerns of course, but if the charges are indeed returned to the system for better mass transit, cleaner trains, more frequent service, then the lowest income folks will benefit most of all.</p>
<p>For example, in NYC we have seen a continued raiding for NYS mass transit funding - this keeps MTA fares going up, routes slashed, service continues to get nibbled away.  If we had a dedicated funding source there would be far better service.</p>
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		<title>By: Stephen Bauman</title>
		<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/comment-page-1/#comment-256706</link>
		<dc:creator>Stephen Bauman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Mar 2011 00:54:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.streetfilms.org/?p=49591#comment-256706</guid>
		<description>The more I look at congestion pricing the less convinced I become of its promise. London&#039;s example is not the success it&#039;s advertised to be.

It has not reduced congestion over the long term. Traffic volumes have been reduced by 20% and have stayed reduced. Congestion initially dropped 30%. It has since  increased so that after 7 years it is worse than before congestion pricing was implemented. 

The initial results were too good. Congestion was down even at times when traffic volumes were the same as before congestion pricing went into effect. Something other than reduced traffic flows was causing decreased congestion.

London compressed about 5 years worth of street and infrastructure repairs during the year before congestion pricing was implemented. London streets were in A-1 condition, when congestion pricing was implemented. They then declined with time. Congestion increased with the decline in street repair.

Congestion pricing is also a very inefficient way to raise funds. The administrative overhead is large. Congestion pricing would be outlawed as a charity because of its huge overhead. Too little of its charging fees are returned to the transportation system.

NYC CBD traffic volumes peaked in 1984. Today&#039;s traffic volumes are already 25% below those volumes. There have been cordon counts since the 1970&#039;s. There is no reliable long term data on congestion for NYC. It&#039;s all anecdotal. I don&#039;t know of hard evidence that traffic is more congested now than in the past. If congestion is indeed bad with volumes down 25%, I&#039;d look to traffic management as the cause and not to increased volume.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The more I look at congestion pricing the less convinced I become of its promise. London's example is not the success it's advertised to be.</p>
<p>It has not reduced congestion over the long term. Traffic volumes have been reduced by 20% and have stayed reduced. Congestion initially dropped 30%. It has since  increased so that after 7 years it is worse than before congestion pricing was implemented. </p>
<p>The initial results were too good. Congestion was down even at times when traffic volumes were the same as before congestion pricing went into effect. Something other than reduced traffic flows was causing decreased congestion.</p>
<p>London compressed about 5 years worth of street and infrastructure repairs during the year before congestion pricing was implemented. London streets were in A-1 condition, when congestion pricing was implemented. They then declined with time. Congestion increased with the decline in street repair.</p>
<p>Congestion pricing is also a very inefficient way to raise funds. The administrative overhead is large. Congestion pricing would be outlawed as a charity because of its huge overhead. Too little of its charging fees are returned to the transportation system.</p>
<p>NYC CBD traffic volumes peaked in 1984. Today's traffic volumes are already 25% below those volumes. There have been cordon counts since the 1970's. There is no reliable long term data on congestion for NYC. It's all anecdotal. I don't know of hard evidence that traffic is more congested now than in the past. If congestion is indeed bad with volumes down 25%, I'd look to traffic management as the cause and not to increased volume.</p>
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		<title>By: D R Sanchez</title>
		<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/comment-page-1/#comment-256702</link>
		<dc:creator>D R Sanchez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Mar 2011 00:24:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.streetfilms.org/?p=49591#comment-256702</guid>
		<description>it strikes me that relying on the market goes against equity concerns.  and unfortunately income/wealth in the US has a long tie to race/ethnic discrimination. is this on the radar at all? what is the experience, from a social equity perspective, in other cities that have congestion pricing?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>it strikes me that relying on the market goes against equity concerns.  and unfortunately income/wealth in the US has a long tie to race/ethnic discrimination. is this on the radar at all? what is the experience, from a social equity perspective, in other cities that have congestion pricing?</p>
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		<title>By: Madeline</title>
		<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/comment-page-1/#comment-256668</link>
		<dc:creator>Madeline</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Mar 2011 19:50:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.streetfilms.org/?p=49591#comment-256668</guid>
		<description>Isn&#039;t congestion pricing obvious solution to the Caltrain fiscal crisis? It&#039;s not like we&#039;re forging new ground here, it already works in London - and San Francisco&#039;s natural geography has already done 3/4ths of the work for us. Raise the costs of the bridges and implement the same camera payment system London has for San Mateo. Make a law that says ALL proceeds must be split between Muni, BART and Caltrain.

If people are paying ~$13/day to come into London (and overall congestion is only reduced by 20%), shouldn&#039;t we be able to do at least $10/day? With 1.9 MILLION daily trips into San Francisco (Source: SamTrans, San Francisco County Transportation Authority), even if San Francisco experienced a 20% drop in daily car commutes (a positive thing!), that would still mean $15.2/million A DAY for public transportation in San Francisco. And FYI, if this all went towards Caltrain, this would solve their deficit in TWO DAYS.

...and that&#039;s not even counting the even more palatable income source: 
http://burritojustice.com/2011/03/08/a-modest-proposal-beer-train/

;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Isn't congestion pricing obvious solution to the Caltrain fiscal crisis? It's not like we're forging new ground here, it already works in London - and San Francisco's natural geography has already done 3/4ths of the work for us. Raise the costs of the bridges and implement the same camera payment system London has for San Mateo. Make a law that says ALL proceeds must be split between Muni, BART and Caltrain.</p>
<p>If people are paying ~$13/day to come into London (and overall congestion is only reduced by 20%), shouldn't we be able to do at least $10/day? With 1.9 MILLION daily trips into San Francisco (Source: SamTrans, San Francisco County Transportation Authority), even if San Francisco experienced a 20% drop in daily car commutes (a positive thing!), that would still mean $15.2/million A DAY for public transportation in San Francisco. And FYI, if this all went towards Caltrain, this would solve their deficit in TWO DAYS.</p>
<p>...and that's not even counting the even more palatable income source:<br />
<a href="http://burritojustice.com/2011/03/08/a-modest-proposal-beer-train/" rel="nofollow">http://burritojustice.com/2011/03/08/a-modest-proposal-beer-train/</a></p>
<p> <img src='http://www.streetfilms.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Streetsman</title>
		<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/comment-page-1/#comment-256666</link>
		<dc:creator>Streetsman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Mar 2011 19:42:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.streetfilms.org/?p=49591#comment-256666</guid>
		<description>To pick up on what Rob said - yes, a lot of the political challenge seemed to me to be related to the lack of driving alternatives in certain areas. Perhaps there could have been exemptions for taxpaying NYC residents whose private, non-commercial vehicles are registered to primary home addresses in NYC neighborhoods that are distant from viable transit options (specifics TBD). Then the objective would be to use the fees to fund service to those areas and then eventually removing the exemption, further reducing core congestion. But the fee coming before the service improvements was asking people in eastern Queens and Brooklyn for a level of trust in the MTA - something that, understandably, few were willing to do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To pick up on what Rob said - yes, a lot of the political challenge seemed to me to be related to the lack of driving alternatives in certain areas. Perhaps there could have been exemptions for taxpaying NYC residents whose private, non-commercial vehicles are registered to primary home addresses in NYC neighborhoods that are distant from viable transit options (specifics TBD). Then the objective would be to use the fees to fund service to those areas and then eventually removing the exemption, further reducing core congestion. But the fee coming before the service improvements was asking people in eastern Queens and Brooklyn for a level of trust in the MTA - something that, understandably, few were willing to do.</p>
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		<title>By: jamie</title>
		<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/comment-page-1/#comment-256646</link>
		<dc:creator>jamie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Mar 2011 18:03:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.streetfilms.org/?p=49591#comment-256646</guid>
		<description>That reminds me ... I need to toot the horn in favor of congestion pricing for weekday evenings, outbound only as a pilot in the SFCTA&#039;s Transportation Plan survey at http://www.sfcta.org/rtp .... we only have until March 24th to get our ideas into the box for consideration!

Still reading this?  Go now to http://www.sfcta.org/rtp and start entering your livable streets wish list!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That reminds me ... I need to toot the horn in favor of congestion pricing for weekday evenings, outbound only as a pilot in the SFCTA's Transportation Plan survey at <a href="http://www.sfcta.org/rtp" rel="nofollow">http://www.sfcta.org/rtp</a> .... we only have until March 24th to get our ideas into the box for consideration!</p>
<p>Still reading this?  Go now to <a href="http://www.sfcta.org/rtp" rel="nofollow">http://www.sfcta.org/rtp</a> and start entering your livable streets wish list!</p>
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		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://www.streetfilms.org/mba-congestion-pricing/comment-page-1/#comment-256633</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Mar 2011 16:08:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.streetfilms.org/?p=49591#comment-256633</guid>
		<description>I think that variable rate congestion pricing is an extremely valuable tool, and far superior to strategies focused on fuel tax increases; however, the manner in which it is implemented requires serious consideration, of course.

In my view, in order to minimize or offset potential equity impacts associated with roadway pricing strategies there must be a high capacity, affordable, and reliable transit alternative to driving on the priced facility. The transit alternative can&#039;t simply be express bus masquerading as BRT operating in mixed-traffic on a new HOT/HOV lane, but rather a legitimate alternative to driving that is part of a broader transit system. The alternative must be made available either prior to implementing pricing or at the same time. Rather than building new HOT/HOV lanes, we should price all existing lanes. 

Unless and until we have implemented pricing in combination with new or improved &quot;real&quot; transit, we should not even consider highway add-a-lane projects; not even to &quot;solve bottlenecks.&quot; We can&#039;t possibly know how much capacity is really needed until the combination is implemented - it may well be that we don&#039;t need additional capacity, but rather a 21st century perspective on solving the problem.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that variable rate congestion pricing is an extremely valuable tool, and far superior to strategies focused on fuel tax increases; however, the manner in which it is implemented requires serious consideration, of course.</p>
<p>In my view, in order to minimize or offset potential equity impacts associated with roadway pricing strategies there must be a high capacity, affordable, and reliable transit alternative to driving on the priced facility. The transit alternative can't simply be express bus masquerading as BRT operating in mixed-traffic on a new HOT/HOV lane, but rather a legitimate alternative to driving that is part of a broader transit system. The alternative must be made available either prior to implementing pricing or at the same time. Rather than building new HOT/HOV lanes, we should price all existing lanes. </p>
<p>Unless and until we have implemented pricing in combination with new or improved "real" transit, we should not even consider highway add-a-lane projects; not even to "solve bottlenecks." We can't possibly know how much capacity is really needed until the combination is implemented - it may well be that we don't need additional capacity, but rather a 21st century perspective on solving the problem.</p>
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